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Stat adjective pairs
So you're not in the dark

So there are a few stats in the game with hidden sub-stats that should be directly affecting your RP, but they don't... they can't... you don't know what they are!

Now... It's pretty clear why these are randomized and hidden, and I don't plan on taking that away.... not entirely. What I'm going to suggest should help give players a better idea of what their character is, rather than letting them stumble around in the dark.

So here's the idea:

For every stat with two substats, there will be adjective pairs. The adjective that is selected to be shown upon the @stats screen will be determined by the sub-stat that is greater than the other. In the case of equal values, it will either select a default or pick one at random. The adjective selected reflects the nature of the character.

For example, the sub-stats in agility might have a pair like:

Precise (CRD > QCK) : Nimble (QCK > CRD)

Thoughts?

In my whole time playing I've given absolutely no thought to substats. Hell, I don't even think it was noted in a help file for quite awhile.

Just pretend they don't exist and RP with your main stats and you'll do just fine.

I was actually going to suggest something similar, advocating one of two things:

1) Let players weigh which sub-stat they want to focus on, distributing their increases at a 66/33 split in favor of your preferred stat instead of a 50/50 to either, or

2) Remove sub-stats from the game entirely.

I brought this up in the town hall meeting and was told that I raised a valid point about the sub-stats having little value to players as they are implemented now, but I'm not sure how much discussion there's been on the GM side.

"Pretend they don't exist" has been what I've been doing, but if they have no reason to exist, then they just shouldn't exist!

Sub-stats seem like an implementation to keep players' minds off min-maxing by hiding a character's attributes in plain sight, so I think they are important. The problem is that I see all over the forum that these sub-stats are apparently being referenced in code, and possibly in the way a puppeted NPC interacts with you, but you personally have no clue what's going on. The major issue that brought this to mind is with charisma. I only listed an example for agility because it was easier to think of the adjectives that could be used off the top of my head.

When I think of the charisma sub-stats coming into play I ask myself whether my character is an unattractive smooth-talker, or hot, yet obnoxious.

I, myself, play a character that's decently attractive, but has very little force of personality. I think having the sub-stats be as obscured as they are now, but providing the option to choose one to focus on, would be the best solution - it'd keep players from min-maxing, since they don't know what their sub-stats are exactly, but they can be confident that one of them is higher than the other, and implement that into their role play.

Assuming that sub-stats are a 50/50 split the standard variance is going to be extremely low among most characters. 'An unattractive smooth-talker' is very unlikely. I don't think addressing this is a priority issue nor is it something that I would personally focus on or worry about.

Or maybe they're a bit of both? Substats shouldn't heavily sway to one side to the that kind of scale.

Substats are more to add a slight human, organic element to things. Two people with identical UE expenditure will not be 100% identical in all stats in practice. Close enough in most ways, definitely, but there's always that small difference. That's the real idea behind it.

Alright, but is giving players a vague idea of where their characters' substats sit completely off the table?

How about a command that can only be used once a month that tells you which of your substats are higher than the other. That should retain the mystery element quite nicely while letting you know where things sit.

@stats check

[ This command can only be run once a month. Are you sure you want to run it now? ]

[ Yes / No ]

yes

Outlook is higher than Awareness

Stamina is higher than Toughness

Coordination is higher than Quickness

Knowledge is higher than Technology

Charm is higher than Appearance

I think being able to tell which one of the sub-stats is higher is not so much information that you need to be limited to using it once a month, personally!

For the most part, knowing your substats doesn't matter so I don't really see why having a command to reveal it serves any purpose. Knowing your exact stats goes 100% against the spirit of the game. And if you have two people fundamentally the same, but differing in subtle ways that only really come out in coded checks, well you shouldn't know that you had some specific advantage in one substat.

Go by your base stats. RP your stats, and raise your stats to match your RP. The end.

Personally, as a still very new player who's still adjusting to the environment of the game and stat-based roleplay, it'd be nice to know if my character was more physically attractive, or if she had had an appealing personality and persona. It's those types of things that can severely affect how a character is played, and subsequent flaws and strengths they have. IE; I'm the most pompous, arrogant bitch on the grid, but because I'm so pretty, people put up with me. Blah, blah, blah.

Frankly, you're reading too much into substats. In my experience you're going to see a fairly even split amongst both categories. At most, maybe 70/30 but that's pretty rare. Make the character who you want them to be and don't worry about the numbers behind the scenes.

Style over substance.