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Some tips for everyone

Here is a tip to newbies, to people making a new character, and to basically everyone in general. I bring it up in regaurds to how you are writting histories, and how they often do not apply or even take into account stats and chargen or any sence of reality at all.

If you want to be happy on the MOO, take these tips. Concider this a guide to Sindome logistics. As I think up more tips, I'll post them here.

[admin] Hey, anyone else out there want to post some tips as well? Try to make them general, things that we topside have issues with. Also note: Please do start looking at stats when you check histories again. It used to be common practice, but it's slipped lately, I myself am to blame as well.[/admin]

Tip #1:
The biggest key is to build a character who -is- small, and have plans to make him/her big. The largest problem with most players is they give these fresh out of chargen characters these -HUGELY- trumpped up life histories. When I'm doing history checks, I typically deny them.

You can't claim to be a CIA trained stealth assassin if your dodge and stealth are at below par and your martial arts are average and you are slow as a snail.

I bring this point up first because for Sindome, the history is fundamentally important to your game life. Without a history, you can't work, play fully, or develope a character. The tendancy for players is to create a trumped up story that is totally unrealistic, and ends up getting denied, or at times, laughed at by the admin. The current push is to in general tone out these types of over-blown histories for ones that are realistic and workable in terms of game mechanics. Basically, if you want an approved history, make it jive with your stats

This means that 'high class assassin' is out. But 'trained under high class assassin for a few months until high class assissin was himself assassinated' is in.

See the differance? You can not come out of chargen a combat god. Or a medical god. Or a nobel lauriate. But you can indicate that you plan to become these things over time through your roleplaying on the MOO.

Doesn't mean your life will -go- that way, you are not locked into becoming any one thing. But it does give your character directions to go in. This is extremely important to keep in mind when writing a history.

Tip #2: You are not a badass

I can't tell you how many times I've seen fresh immigrants step through the checkpoint and attack the first thing they see only to get their ass handed to them.

Yes, the gangers are unrealistically badass. Thats because their designed to be a threat to your existance. Don't fuck with them. If were not around and you do, you'll mostlikely die since they tend to gang up on people.

If you type 'kill' in your first week of play out of anything except self-defense, you are probably doing something wrong. You've gotta figure out the big fish are, who the medium fish are and who the rest of the little fish are before you can 'stake your claim'.

~ J

Tip #3: The Great History Game

Oh, the great game where players rush out a schlock history because they need a history to work.

Sad. Sad. Sad. So totally misguided you are my children. But that is why I am here! To save you from your own folly!

Yes, it is true that one of the things a history enables you to do is get work. BUT THAT IS SIMPLY A SIDE EFFECT! The real reason for a history is to....*drum roll* DEFINE YOUR CHARACTERS MOTIVATIONS AND PAST!

Simple coded jobs like Shinohara and the like are low end jobs that will never really get you any money in the game at all any way. They are more a placebo for players because they complain all the time about no work or money. The real money, the REAL hardcore chyen is in work that you roleplay and generate yourself! Selling information, theft, begging, looting, working your way up the ranks in a corp, working your way up the ranks of a gang, working your way up the ranks of an illegal boxing ring!

And what defines which of those directions your character can take? That's right. Your history. It sets the basis and explaination for the why's and hows of the skills you pick during chargen. It is the IC representation of your characters stats.

Histories also guide and direct the motives and initial nature of the character. Note that. INITIAL. As you play, as you experiance the game, your character may radically change. If you have a happy go-lucky young woman, who had a great life in the burbs, decent folks too poor to send her to college, but they died and left her enough money to get here, to Withmore for her 'big chance at the corporate ladder'. She gets here, her eyes are full of stars, her head full of dreams.

She then steps through those lovely gates, gets a chip jammed in her head, and is instantly bombarded with requests for sex, offers of a safe, work at home job as a whore, asked if she's willing to sell her ovaries for clone stock, and greated with enough advertising to kill a cow. Then as she walks further along the way, to get some clothing at the thrift store to replace the duds she's got on now (worn from travel) she gets attacked and raped by a gang of teenagers.

Well. Look at that. She -DID- have a happy go lucky history, but the dome changed that right quick.

Understand? The history says a lot about the characters past, and about the character at the moment they enter the dome. As things happen, this may or may not change depending on how you want to play the character.

So, to recap: The history is far more than just 'a way to get a job'. It is the definition of your stats and the nature of your character up to the point of entry into the dome. As you play, things change. BUT the past of a character will always float about in how they act in some manner, be it in jaded referances at the foolish past, or as a fatal flaw in the character, or as simply reminiscances over a pint at the Drome.

So do not make a history 'just to get a job' or 'just to get it out of the way'.

Make a history to breathe life and love into the character.

TIP NUMBER 4!

STAY IN CHARACTER!

At all times, in all circumstances unless you have been asked to -BY- a staff member you are to remain IN CHARACTER.

I REPEAT.

REMAIN IN CHARACTER.

IC. All the time.

This friendly tip will save you from pages, yellings, cellings, newtings, and much friction and torment. You are here to role play, so your character should, no MUST, have an IC reason for his/her/its actions AT ALL TIMES. In real life one doesn't go up to that hardass thug on the street corner, pick a fight, and then say 'Okay okay, stop, I just wanted to test my agl!'

So.

To Repeat. Again.

ALWAYS BE IN CHARACTER

If you are in the IC world, and you are not in character, you are fucking up and will get talked to about it.

IN character.

God, I hope I've said this enough times for it to sink in. Once more.

STAY IN CHARACTER.

[admin] This ones for you Kev (Freakin Aikao), you think they'll get it? [/admin]

I - N   C - H - A - R - A - C - T - E - R

just to follow that up....

for newbies and ultra sensitive players alike...

if a character is being a bitch to you... it's the character NOT the player that got up on the wrong side of the bed.

i mean... i know we are supposed to know this right?

just a random thought gnawing at the back of my brain that i think sometimes needs restating

I do love that whole IC thing. It's the whole reason we roleplay. Another character and I once had a yelling, screaming fight for literally an hour and a half. Everyone in Westinghaus must have heard us going at it. To this day I don't think I've strung that many obscene words together and screamed them at the top of my lungs. It was great. And I'm still good OOC friends with the owner of that character.

TIP NUMBER 5

Now this tip goes in line with staying in character, or rather, staying in -THEME-.

There is a distinct theme and flavour to cyberpunk. A gertain ju-neh-seh-kwah if you will. And a HUGE portion of that feeling, that aura is GREED. Money makes the Mix go round. Money makes the corps go round. Money makes everything work and spin in a bright pattern of beautiful commerce.

GREED.

So, when you are playing, you should always ask yourself a few important questions. The first being:

What do I get out of this?
What are you gaining by helping some one? By lending them money? By selling them information, equipment, ect.

A favour in the future? Is it a freebie to get them hooked on you as a supplier of (insert illegal thing here)? Is it to get, of course, CHYEN!

Always, ALWAYS ask your self when you are helping/interacting with other players. -what- do -I- get out of this deal?

The second question one should always ask is:

What can you do for me?

Simple idea here. When you have an ally, friend, temporary business associate, always ask yourself what they can do for you. What good are they in your group? What help can they be to you? Are they skilled or free-loaders? Are they worth keeping about?

What can they do for you.

The third question is:

Is this relationship/deal/whatever still PROFITABLE!

If it isn't brining in cash flow, and it is costing you -MONEY-, WHY? Why deal with the situation, end it as cleanly and profitable as possible. End it with as little loss to life/cash/resources as possible. It is -ALL- about profit. Gear, info, connections, chyen, ect. If you are constantly on the loosing end, fuck, stop loosing!

The fourth question is:

Who's side am I on?

It is impossible to play everyone. You end up just shifting chyen from person to person, never really getting a head. In every transaction there has to be a looser. There has to be someone who comes out on -top-. And for FUCK sake it should be you. So you need to know -who- you like, -who- you hate, and most importantly, -who- you wanna take chyen from. Once you know these simple things, go after the buck like a bat out of hell. Hussle and shake, move and dance. Kill. Maim. Rob. Steal. Torture. Get that chyen.

the fifth question is:

What am I good at/for?

What can you do? You a decker? Deck. You a Razor-girl, hire out your services. You a hussler? Hussle.

What good is a Cyberdoc in a fight? NOTHING! Just like you don't want some muscled up joeboy hackin open your spine to insert than new speed boost.

Do what you do, and always make sure you don't do it for free. And when you do, you -BETTER- make sure you get -SOMETHING- out of it. Even if it is just a quick lay.

Before you make the character you desire first it might be a good idea to make a basic character just to figure out the basics of the game system. Or, you could always just make one char and play him for a year.

Tip #6: READ THE FOLLOWING!

Read these damnit, they are some of the most important things to know in the GAME!

@rules
@newbie
help theme
help timeline


READ THEM! READ THEM!! READ THEM!!!

Not to steal the thunder of Iga and Jman and all, but I'd like to offer a suggestion to people new to the game or the genre or both, that works with several of the Tips so correctly posted here before.

We'll call it Tip 6.x and directly relates to tips 1,2,3 .. well, all of them actually.

For your first character, pick a skill set that will -require- you to learn to survive by your wits.

Be a techie type
Be a decker
Be a doc
Be a corpie
Be any one of -many- possible non combat types.

Be -ANYTHING- but a character who relies on fighting/shooting/sneaking ...

Maybe do this for the first two, or three, or however many characters it takes until you understand how this HellHole we lovingly call the Dome works, and how to survive when you have no possible way to defend yourself using your own abilities.

Don't make a character that has even the remotest possibility of defending him/her self in a fight.

Yes, yes, I know you want to be a Judge/TERRA agent/[InsertGenericBadAssNameHere], and someday, you just may be. �But when you are dripping wet out of the vat that is chargen, pretty much any rat (or any other character or NPC a week older than you) in the city can kick your ass (regardless of your skills).

Why? �The main reason (other than the rats) is smarts. �They're smarter than you (well, maybe the rats too ... ;))

They know how this place works, and lives and breathes.

They know the shortcuts, the best places to hide, and they (seemingly including the rats) have friends.

However, as odd as it sounds, if you learn how to survive by your wits instead of your guns, both you, -and- the game, become better off.

If you learn to survive by using your wits ..

You won't learn to rely on skills and stats you don't have, (but think you should if you handn't followed tips mentioned previously).

You will most likely RP a hell of a lot more.

You will most likely -not- become annoying to those who can and will kick your ass, or have your ass kicked (but the rats will still hate you)

You will most likely live longer because you won't be as tempted to die because you got pissed off by someone, thought you were a BigBadAss (tm) (but were only a BigBadAssWannabe (tm)) and decided to "stand up for your principles", because you now -know- you can't fight, so you have to run away and live to fight another day.

By running away to live to fight another day, you -need- to get sneaky, nasty, dirty, tricky, treacherous ... in order to get the vengance you so rightly deserve.

Just because you can't fight, doesn't mean you have to be a pushover. �It just means sometimes you have to look like a pushover.

What's gonna make you look better .. standing up and being dead, or looking like a wuss for a week or two until word that it was -you- who ordered the hit on so and so ... or you put the word out on the street that so and so (who this certain Judge is looking for anyway because you tipped him about [insert some random crime here] killed him ...

See my point?

And that, my little mirrorshades wearin' wannabes, is part of what cyberpunk is about. �Why be in the heavy hitter's face and risk getting severely beat down when you can find a more sneaky way to do it, and maybe frame another enemy for it?

It's not about who's got the biggest gun.

It -does not- have to be about stats. �Often players make it that way, but it does not have to be.

Yes, it -is- hard being new to the Dome, whether this is your first, or tenth character.

Yes, it sure seems unfair most of the time.

Yes, you absolutely need to stand up for yourself.

Yes, you should not go gently into that good night.

Yes you should hold that grudge and extract your pound of flesh.

Make it easy on yourself. �Don't look like a threat and you won't be considered one.

And remember ... above all else ..

Style over Substance


(Edited by Max at 4:50 pm on Feb. 14, 2003)

(Edited by Max at 4:58 pm on Feb. 14, 2003)

Fuck skills.  No, I mean it.  Fucks skills and fuck stats.

They are irrevellent.  Sure, they help your character to stay alive should you actually GET IN A FIGHT.  Or they help you get something should you actually try and STEAL it.  They help you do numerous things.  But all of these things are the EASY way out.

How fucking exciting can that be?  Not very.

It's boring as fuck to tell you the truth.  Not to mention you will almost certainly get busted for something eventually, shouldyou always seek the easy way to do it.  THINK, PEOPLE!  FUCING USE YOUR MINDS!  Outsmart people.  Make plans ICly to get money.  If you can't do something, hire someone who can.  Work things out the way they would be worked out in the real world.

Seriously, folks..  Don't be a dumbass.  And don't be lazy.  You have to go out and search for shit.  You have to do work yourself in order to make plans work.  You have to OOCly use your brain.  Not rely on your "Intelligence stat" to do the work for you.  Hell, the GMs and various other admin aren't gonna wipe your ass for you.  They do enough as it is.  Figure out how to make things work yourself and I GUARENTEE that you'll have the admin interested.  They're not gonna be motivated to help if they know you're an idiot.  So don't be one.

Oh, and I'm sorry if I've offended anyone.  But if I have:  Fucking deal with it.

Other than that, I love you all.  :D

hehehehehe

fuck stats and skills..

you saying that is so funny for so many reasons.

While I'm thinking about it...here's some advice for not-so-newbies...


When confronted with a situation IC, don't let ooc factors be the thing that guides you..

In other words, don't assume that because your character is older, that they're "better" than someone else. Judge your reactions on ic events and knowledge.

;)

I gotta agree with KF on that one... amusing, tho maybe the reasons I find it amusing aren't the same as his.

Yea, fuck stats and skills...

Max strength, max combat skills, then RP smart assed conman... ignoring the fact you've just created a retarded thug.

Expect to get WJF employment with dodge, martial arts and zero law. Sure, they hand out super lethal handguns to -everyone- who can't even figure out which end to point at the enemy. (Poor Casey... ;))

Half the problem is that people create characters who can hold their own in a fight then write complete bollocks histories about their past as corporate CEO's, chiefs of police, hacker gods, etc, etc.

Fuck stats and skills, coz it's sure as hell too challenging to RP around them.

(and yes, I get what you're trying to say, you just screwed up how you're saying it... I hope)

Fact of the matter is, stats and skills are an integral part of the game. Look at them. So RP your character based not only on his personality and history, but -also- on his stats and skills.

But the fact of the matter is, with the UE system, you control your stats and skills. YOU decide what your character is good at, how smart he is, how attractive, how fast, and how strong.

So RP based on your stats, but make your stats fit your RP.
For instance, if you start playing your character smart, boost your INT. You guys wouldn't believe the number of things I've figured out about how the IC world works just idling in the locker room. Half of them I passed up because my character simply didn't have the INT to figure these things out. So, I boosted my INT. That simple.
After I boosted my charisma, I re-desced my character to reflect this. After I boosted my AGI and STR, ditto. From head to toe.

But don't forget that you CAN screw someone over even if they're statistically better than you. Even if you're in combat, don't let your skills and stats do all the talking. Pick your weapons carefully, postures as well. Know when to disarm, when to grapple, and when to run. Combat most often will NOT benefit you, just like in real life, so avoid it if you can. If you can't avoid it, then make the other guy(s) play on your terms.

And I have to agree with Ras about histories. If your histories are so outlandish, it's only embarassing for you, because if you screw up, chances are your ex-marine ninja hacker jabberwocky-slaying babylonian god is going to get his ass handed to him by a regular ol' fellow from Dublin. And that has to be a bit embarrasing.

The history you develop from your RP in-game is a LOT more important than what you submit at the start. You want all your characters' best moments to be things you have played out and will play out, not something you typed up on a lazy sunday afternoon.

It's always amazing to me when people (who will remain nameless) have Charismas of 'Repulsive', and are dressed in red fassion (complete with day-glo gogles) are suprised when other people don't respond well to them.

They get all indignant, and even sometimes have the gall to bitch over xhelp about favoritism and admins hating them.

One of these days I'm gonna loose my cool and say something like, "Yeah? Maybe if you hadn't fallen out of the ugly tree, hit every ugly branch on the way down, slamed hard into the ugly grass, got bit by the ugly dog, beaten with the ugly stick, and rolled over by the ugly steamroller, you wouldn't be having these problems!"

But usually I just say something like, "Dude, try a breath mint or something."

Still pretty amusing when it happens though.

-Kevlar

Heh

I don't bitch -alot-...

Seems people completely misunderstood what I was trying to say, but oh well. �I don't know how else to explain it. �Another thing: �I would just like to state that I do RP according to my character's stats, so please don't assume otherwise. �I always have. �But I also play according to my character's own mentality and beliefs. �If he gets in a fight with someone who has better combat stats he gets his ass handed to him. �But just because I know OOCly that they probably have better stats and skills doesn't mean that ICly I would know that. �And the result? �Ike gets his ass handed to him sometimes, and sometimes he doesn't. �Just as it should be in real life. �I say fuck stats because they should be seen as OOC information even though they directly affect your character's abilities. �They should not have any influence when it comes down to confronting another character in some reason or other, be it fighting or stealing or what have you. �Base your decision to confront another character by the purely IC "stat" of Confidence, which would be affected by the both the character's ego and his/her experience with confronting that individual in the past.

And I'm not even going to bother getting into the disarming issue.

(Edited by Aikao at 1:55 pm on May 6, 2003)

My point is, stats AREN'T ooc information. They're IC, in fact, they're very IC, as they represent the capabilities of your character. Now, the 'words' or 'numbers', the units of mesurement, what have you, are OOC, but the stats themselves, or rather what they represent, are not.

IRL, if you can bench press 300lbs, it's not some metaphysical aspect of the universe to be discussed philosophically in coffee shops with people wearing overly tight turtleneck sweaters and berets while writing trite haiku on laptops, it's hard fact. And that's what stats are.

And Ike, AFAIK, you HAVE fought someone with better combat skills/stats than you in the past and won, which should tell you that there's more than stats involved in the outcome of combat.

And besides from that, people have IC reputations. Before confronting someone, it's a smart thing to find out about this person. And some have inflated reputations, far beyond the scope of their stats - simply because rumours of what they've done (and not HOW they did it) are floating around. It's all part of the game.

Uhm.. �as far as I can see, we're both arguing the same point, minus a few minor details of course.


Generally we have the same idea about stats. �What I meant by them being OOC info was merely that they are not something that is generally shared with everyone else within the game. �No one else knows the exact nature of your character's stats. �Sure they know you might be fast, or smart or something, but that's just because of your reputation! �

I understand why you say they are IC information. �They basically run the game. �And sometimes (unfortunately) they have more of a weight on things than regular RP does.

You said you should fit your stats to your RP.  I suppose I agree with this, with one exception.  There has to be a REASON, and a somewhat explainable process in which you improve with something.  Did you have plastic surgery?  Practice your bartering skills in the markets?  Practice your katana skills in full-concentration?  Meditate or read books to improve your understanding of computers, or just the way the world works?  There's got a be a reason to up your stats and skills, even if you're RPing by your lonesome.  And yes, I do practice this, regardless of how silly you or anyone else may think it is.  I personally believe its necessary for this to happen.  People don't just get better looking without any apparent reason.  People don't aim guns better by just sitting around by injecting a UE serum into their arm.  They learn.  And there;s a story behind it.  Every UE I have assigned has had a reason to be there.  

As for why Ike beat that someone with higher stats?.. �I still think there was a bit more behind that than people are telling me, and I don't really enjoy it when I can't be promised the truth. �But as are most things, that's a confusing combination of IC and OOC information that is best not to be discussed.

Regardless of what others may think, I still consider myself an honorable person, and an honorable player.

(Edited by Aikao at 5:38 am on May 7, 2003)

Well, the fact of the matter is, the UE system may not be the most realistic, but it's fair and it works.
As for people learning - yeah, there has to be a reason.
But the fact is, you don't need plastic surgery to raise your charisma, for instance - you could do the same with better hygene, cleaner clothes, practicing your speaking voice, improving your manners and so forth. And apart from that, does your character actually sleep every moment you're not logged on? In-game, yes, because it'd be odd to have the game have your character do things. But maybe your character is taking the time to read a book, exercise, whatever - it's a bit thin, but it's still a sort of justification. You don't need to RP -everything-, though doing it can be fun. The important thing is to have an IC reason up there in your head as to why your character is getting stronger, faster, smarter, and less smelly. How much of it you RP, is up to you. Myself, for instance, I tend to to raise my combat skills/stats when my character's been getting into (or picking) fights. When things are calm, I concentrate  on things like Intelligence, charisma, and so forth - my character being in the unique position where he not only has to fight, he also has to write and file reports, question, investigate and so forth. So, so long as I don't start raising, I dunno, cracking, stimsimming and auto tech (or whatever else)...

Indeed.

Quote: from Murphy on 4:15 pm on May 7, 2003[br]Well, the fact of the matter is, the UE system may not be the most realistic, but it's fair and it works.

Actually, I don't think it is that fair. I think it rewards players don't take risks and encourages  the attitude that there's a hierarchy of characters, based upon how long they've been around, not what they've done in that time.


for example:

Someone makes a new character, gets on maybe 2 hours a day, but RP's for that whole time, mixes things scrapes a living, enriches the moo for everyine while they're on. That person will get 1 ue a day, maybe an extra one through the week somewhere, but ue will be few and far between for that person.

Someone else has been playing a character for 2 years, logs in for 10 hours a day, spends 9 hours and 40 minutes of that time idle, doing no more than hitting 'look' or 'who' from inside thier cube every few minutes. they then spend 20 minutes talking to somone over SIC or whatever, and log off. - they get 3 UE a day.

That doesn't seem very fair to me.

But yeah, it does work.

Plus, Cyberware should go someway to bridging the gap between old and new blood.

Yea... coz we won't mention the names of the people who used to log on 3 times a day, at certain times for like 10 seconds just to make sure they leeched the maximum possible points from the system -every- single day... Coz that'd be a terrible way to become one of the most powerful chars in the game, wouldn't it? ;)

Quote: from King[Fu] on 12:41 pm on May 8, 2003[br]

Actually, I don't think it is that fair. I think it rewards players don't take risks and encourages �the attitude that there's a hierarchy of characters, based upon how long they've been around, not what they've done in that time.



Well, obviously it's not perfect, no system CAN be perfect, especially when there are people involved.
But it's fairer than the alternatives.
Basically, the UE system is ROT (rate over time).
Now, alternative #1 is by skill use. Now, anyone who's played on an RP MU* or UO shard or somesuch will know how unfair that is - A little anecdote (Ras has already heard this one, so, Ras, no need to read this bit.)
A long time ago, in a semi-WHFRP-based, rp-enforced, UO shard woth permanent death, far, far away....

DOOOOOO! DobedoodoodoodoobedoodoodooDOODOOOO....

I played this barbarian character. I rped him, i had fun RPing him. I didn't have much time to RP him, maybe banked an hour a day, sometimes I'd spend the entire day playing him when I had the time and the mood struck me. It was good.
Eventually, through pure RP and a lot of adventuring (N.B.: adventuring is NOT killing monsters) and getting my ass kicked, I eventually, after a year or so, got him in a position of leadership of one of the five 'factions' of the world. The first in command wasn't online...ever...so my character did all the work, and all the diplomacy (which was very funny!). I basically rebuilt the weakest, most ignored faction on the shard near to something halfway decent (it was a work in progress!), a task with so little previous success that had worn out two leaders before my character. But I stuck in there, and I worked for it, I built up our forces (with like-minded, rp-centred barbarian newbies).
Now the way skill/stat gain is done there is through use, like all UO shards. Now, of course, you usually have these teenagers from some scandinavian country who do nothing but go to school and boost their stats.
One such group, with almost completely maxed-out stats and very mediocre rp skills (or at least very poor english, which, on an english-language shard, is near the same thing, especially when you're supposed to be playing a noble or something), decided they wanted to take over what I'd built. Of course, I wasn't online 24/7, I had a job and a girlfriend. They started bitching to the GMs that I was 'never' online (meaning I wasn't logged in when they WANTED me to be, on their wonky swedish timezones), so, since they had logged so many hours and probably given little swedish boy blowjobs to one or two staff members, they were allowed to break the rules (which prohibits takeover attempts when faction leadership is not online), they killed all my (expensive) NPCs with their inflated stats and got control of the town and all my character's money and things.
Of course, one of them (the oldest one, surprise) realized what had happened exactly and quit the game afterwards, for which he has my eternal respect. Me, I quit the game and oddly enough, all my fellow barbarians (the ones in my faction) came with me. Which I didn't expect, it was sort of cool.

Is that fairer? That statistical hierarchy be based on how much of a life one doesn't have and/or the player's inability to score? I don't think so.

The third alternative is that GMs give out 'points', but that is inherently unfair because a GM might be paying attention to something else, or one may not be able to log on and RP when there's an abundance of GMs online to make sure that everyone gets the stat raises they deserve.


So, the UE system is just about the fairest you can get, it doesn't encourage anything but logging on multiple times a day (which isn't all that hard, even if you're working), and doesn't encourage mass killing or repetitive sparring. It's not perfect, because there are human beings involved. If someone DOESN'T scrap on at least a semi-regular basis and raises their combat stats, well, that's between them and their conscience.

Ahh, the old blow jobs, corruption, loyalty and manipulation story again... isn't it -always- the same.

Silly scandinavian barbarians.

And no, that's definately unfair.  Perhaps if we're going to talk about this though, we should start another thread.

Personally I think it'd be interesting to try and think of a more fair way to earn UE.  Something that may actually be constructive (and yes, I realize its highly unlikely that the UE system will be changed anytime soon..  but we could still talk about it, right?  ;) )

Yea... coz we won't mention the names of the people who used to log on 3 times a day, at certain times for like 10 seconds just to make sure they leeched the maximum possible points from the system -every- single day...

We throw people like that in the cell, along with the people who go around testing the code and looking for bugs instead of roleplaying, thoes who think it's funny to jump off buildings, walk in front of cars, and kill sleeping homeless people, and thoes who like to bitch over xhelp instead of dealing with the IC hand they've been delt. We can't prevent them from gaining more UE, but we can prevent them from playing the game. Admittedly these senarios -generally- only happen with newbies, who we then try our best to council.

And UE is not the requirement to become the most powerful person in the game. This has been proven time and time again. I'de give you some GREAT examples of people with tons of UE who have no sway at all, and people with relatively lowly stats who have been very very influencial people, but I can't use IC names here.

-Kevlar

Quote: from Kevlar on 5:48 pm on May 8, 2003[br]

thoes who think it's funny to jump off buildings


That's silly. It's so much more funny to shove people -off- buildings.


Uhm.....I mean..

I'm just reading this topic, well skimming really, for another topic.

I am always amazed at how many pots love to call the kettle black. This topic has officially been 'BUMPED'.

TIP NUMBER 7

Use @stats as a guideline, not as a crutch.

There is a lot of merit to the above discussions on stats and skills. One of the most important things that you as a player have to understand is that it is OUT OF CHARACTER to roleplay a slick con man if your CHARACTER is STUPID.

Or to roleplay a SEXY character, or even a SOCIALLY ACCEPTABLE character if you are UGLY, SMELLY, and CREEPY.

Look at your stats now and then, and refresh yourself as to what they are telling you. If you are stupid, DO NOT GO OUT AND SOLVE COMPLEX IN GAME RIDDLES.

Is this hard? HELL YES! Especially if you love riddles, and love solving things, and are an intelligent person. It is very hard to 'dumb down' your character at times. But it is also very rewarding. It is FUN to play stupid, naive, or crazy if that is what your character is.

So, to repeat the general tip here:

Look at your stats, and role play within the limitations of those stats at all times.

(hehe...bumped...)

Personally, the stats always piss me off. They're not written in stone especially as far as rp goes.

Just because your charisma isn't too great doesn't mean your ugly what it could mean is that you don't brush your hair and have a tendency to scratch yourself.
Just because your not that smart doesn't mean you can't use big words, maybe it means you can't remember shit or...yeah, whatever. You get the point.

Take a good look at your stats, decide on some of your weaknesses and your strengths as a character.

I love this topic.

Not to muddy the waters, but I wanted to add my own addendum to Tip #7:

TIP NUMBER 7A

Increase your Stats based on your IC actions.

I think it's important to think about what your character has done, and increase stats based on this.  Did you spend your time sneaking behind people and making farting noises?  Increase Stealth.  Did you do a bit of trading?  Increase that then.  Spend your time trying to convince people how good looking/bad ass/etc. you are?  Increase Charisma.

This way, your stats really end up being a reflection of who your character IS, not who you (the player) WANT your character to be.

You may end up with a different character than you planned, but it is much more organic and (in my opinion) much more fulfilling.

(Edited by n8n at 11:29 am on Feb. 24, 2005)

This is an OLD as hell subject, but I think it needs readdressing.

Personally so far to me since I've started playing? RP does not beat stats/skills. Sure RP helps out, but in the end, who evers got the best stats/skills and (especially if they're an oldfag) the better position is just going to win out. And this makes things frustrating to players that haven't been here for months or years. How is a new player supposed to be able to make themselves useful when any oldfag can come along and outshine them, or beat them into a pulp and it just doesn't matter?

There's a post earlier mentioning GREED, well, there's several incidents where I haven't seen GREED, but instead just wanton lust for death and mayhem. And while this is perfectly acceptable because it's IC, it also doesn't allow for the expansion of RP. How are we supposed to keep new players hooked and wanting to play here if it's soooo easy to get regarded as useless and killed? You can do so much more to a character to get what you want out of it than killing them. Even if you don't want anything out of them you can still do other things to help expand story arcs.

Of course there are always exceptions, of course there are certain circumstances. But when I've mostly encountered only one way to resolve a violent conflict since I've started playing here, it becomes really annoying hard to want to stay around when stats/skills win out over RP almost every single time.

Please replace all 'oldfag' references to ''oldbie" lingo mistake. Lost in translation moment.

I can see how this is frustrating but i've been playing a very new character for about a month now, and i haven't had a problem yet, part of that is because i play the character carefully, but he still has a crazy ton of drama, a lot of RP that puts him in not only awkward situations, that make his life interesting, but also that develops him into how far he can go and progress. i think not everything has to be about violence, it's about getting what you want, so if your character wants to kill a lot then, he'll probably want to have stats that reflect that, and RP getting into the right bunch of people to help back him up. but not all characters need that. i've been quite successful by being the weak character, stated above. it's not always the most fun, being able to get your ass handed to you, but there can be a lot of success, mainly from hiding the fact that you are a manipulative bastard who seeks to direct attention away from yourself. it takes some work and it might not always work, but i've not seen the whole stats win out every time bit just quite yet. Maybe i'm not around quite long enough, but there's a lot to be done to avoid that whole thing.

Stryder, you've done more than your fair share of stirring the hornets' nest to incur IC consequences. It's not as if you're being targeted randomly or with whimsy.

For that matter, many of those characters who have given you trouble have not necessarily had better skills than you or more time played.

There are ways to confront these situations when you're the underdog. One-on-one combat and combat in general is far from your only option(s).

But it's somewhat moot when you're saying that 'stats/skills trump RP every time' when you're reaping the fruits of your own RP, not falling prey to the machinations of older characters who have struck out against you.

I'm not the one that jumps to the combat. So far, when it comes to humans, I've yet to be the one that starts the fight when I've died. Beyond that I cannot comment.

Not typing 'attack x' first doesn't mean that you aren't the one who has lead your character to their death.

I think the expectation of stepping on toes as a younger player against more numerous, more connected and more powerful foes and not preparing for consequences, then being dismayed when you get them, is a little unrealistic.

Death occurs much more suddenly and over much less with some regularity, even to older characters. I can't claim to be 100% of aware of what happens for you in-game but the situations your character has died in that I've been aware of, it's struck me as pretty lenient. Death occurs over somebody talking smack to the wrong person on the wrong street.

I can guarantee you that if you were playing with a year on your character in UE with the same mindset and approach to the game you would be dismayed to find yourself in the same boat.

Also keep in mind that no 'oldbies' (though I'm fairly certain that you've misconceived how old some of your aggressors are) are out to bully you or ruin your game. You don't get killed as an OOC punishment. When you get killed, it's because of RP that lead up to it. Death comes easy in Sindome and most losses are fast replaced. When your character isn't killed, you shouldn't be taking that as an OOC slight.

You've just been given an RP lifeline. You've just been given something to fight for. You have a goal. Your character has something to strive towards. Whether that's fighting for their life or seeking revenge, there you have it - you're in the thick of all that is this game.

Sometimes you can log onto the MUD and search all over your resident district and struggle to find something to do. This is more of a problem for certain characters than others - some characters are more passive. This is fine. But it's possible to spend a while in one of these slow periods.

But not a character whose just died. They've just been extended an invitation, a golden ticket to jump into the game and strike right into the meat of things.

I'm sorry that you're feeling disheartened. But really, you shouldn't be. You've succeeded in creating a stir. You should be reaping the benefits of it, not calling foul because things went badly for your character.

To reiterate on a point that I can't stress more which goes for everybody;

Not typing 'attack x' first doesn't mean that you aren't the one who has lead your character to their death.

It's possible with your RP that may as well have been at the other terminal typing the 'attack y' command yourself.

There seems to be a sort of stigma against coded combat in this community. I certainly agree that there are more interesting ways of ruining ones' character than killing them. But there's a place for it. If you're killed by a combat character, especially when you're the instigator, you shouldn't feel cheated. Nor should people be be holding themselves 'above combat' or looking down on the players who decide to incorporate that into how they play the game.

I can guarantee you that if you were playing with a year on your character in UE with the same mindset and approach to the game you would be dismayed to find yourself in the same boat.

And this is the annoying part, because my character DOESN'T TRY to step on toes. My character has tried quite a bit to placate toes they have stepped on. What ever mindset you THINK I bring to the game you have totally wrong. The more I read of what you say regarding my characters the more I feel like you have no idea what they -REALLY- do.

Getting killed to me is not a way to jump right back into the meat of things. Barely surviving is.

I'm certainly not claiming to know exactly what intentions you set out with, so I apologize if I gave you that impression.

Rather, I'm trying to reflect to you the impression that I get (from you), with the goal of helping you understand what's going on. How players view their character and how the population views their character are seldom the same, from what I can tell.

Likewise you have to remember that there's a lot of information that you aren't privy to, which might agitate relationships concerning your character. If you don't believe that the actions of other characters are justified, believe me their player does. We're all mature RPers here.

'Getting killed to me is not a way to jump right back into the meat of things. Barely surviving is.'

Barely surviving and getting killed aren't a huge leap from one-another around here.

'And this is the annoying part, because my character DOESN'T TRY to step on toes. My character has tried quite a bit to placate toes they have stepped on. What ever mindset you THINK I bring to the game you have totally wrong. The more I read of what you say regarding my characters the more I feel like you have no idea what they -REALLY- do. '

This doesn't invalidate what I'm saying, by the way. Furthermore, saying I have no idea what's going on in your head doesn't mean that I can't tell the approach you've taken is working out for you badly (your posting about how it's working badly for you here). I can see the effects their actions have had on the game world. I could be completely wrong about where I think your character is coming from or their motivations, their goals, but that doesn't seem to be an argument against what you were replying to.

The problem I have is that the approach is one I've been told to use by people IC and OOC and it just doesn't work for me. I've tried several types of approaches and it just doesn't work.

Now, to clarify, this approach doesn't work with other players. When it comes to NPCs, the approach works enough to keep me alive. Maybe not in good graces or in any outcome I wanted it to fall under, but I don't get killed.

Just thought i'd chime in here by saying you shouldn't treat PC's and NPC's differently

I don't, that's why I'm pointing it out. I treat them the same but I get drastically different responses.

This'll probably be my last post in this thread.

What I'd like you to consider is, as I've said above, that your character's dilemma is your OOC profit.

I don't think your notions about the larger stat pool always winning are entirely fair considering the facts and I don't agree with them. But to address those; you don't have to look very far to see a new character who is striving forwards, succeeding and making waves in the game-world. Likewise, characters can make waves with their misfortunes and the enemies they can rally against themselves. One player comes to mind who in-fact practically specializes in this, repeatedly getting shafted in-game because their brand of characters are extremely successful at being those we 'love to hate'. Neither one of these styles of player is worse than the other, they're both very good types of player to have in this game. Neither style has an entry UE cap and more storied PCs will find ways to overcome a gulf of UE, chyen or sheer numbers.

---

As an aside, re: your last post, I think if you look at most MU*s you'll see three types of players - those who have no luck with PCs, those who have no luck with NPCs and those who have no luck with environmental hazards. Your experience doesn't necessarily reflect a larger picture at play.

Trust me, if an NPC is given a reason to kill your character and they're the type of personality to do so, they will. NPCs don't have as much time to meticulously build a case against you like PCs might, so that's also something to consider. PCs have a lot more information than their @notes to take into account when deciding how to react to you.

*bump*

*super extra bump*

Really digging these tips, even though I'm not new.

bumping this as a new player

This helps me a lot, and the back and forth in the thread also are helpful to me in picturing how the character is going, not necessarily how I WANT him to go.