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SIC, Shit Talk, and Bleed
the meanest social network ever

I've noticed an uptick lately in what feels like bleed in response to SIC callouts, shit talk, arguments or other mean-spirited IC public verbal throwdowns. I want to make a thread to accomplish or at least point out a couple of things.

First, it's probably best to remind everyone, on both ends of any conflict, that your IC beef should not be making you upset OOC. That's a tall order since the game is very high stakes at times, but it's best to remind yourself that appropriate in-character insults are directed at your character, not you.

Second, I have seen a lot of IC insults that insinuate some level of OOC wrongdoing in others, which makes the first point difficult to stick to. Mainly, I see a lot of things said along the lines of 'you do nothing', and this has been a fad that's outlived it's welcome by a large margin. It doesn't make sense from an IC standpoint; if a character is bad at their job, say that. If they're bad at running events, say that. If they're bad at networking, say that.

The catch-all 'do nothing' is oftentimes a quasi-IC callout that insinuates a player has nothing to offer or contribute to the game at large, and that's not cool in my eyes. It's completely nonsensical from an IC standpoint, as I have never heard even the most vitriolic people in real life use 'you do nothing' as some kind of insult. It is bringing up some imaginary OOC scoreboard of waves made, instead of attacking the IC qualities, flaws, or actions of characters.

Can we all agree to do better? I sorely miss seeing IC toxicity that felt IC and themely. If I'm overreacting from the sidelines, maybe the thread is not necessary after all, but I'm hoping this reaches the right ears.

Yeah, I've always found the "you do nothing" shit annoying. Especially since it implies the value of your character is based on how public the knowledge of your deeds is.
I agree. The do nothing stuff is shit. Be entertaining with your insults on sic. We're here to entertain eachother and play a game and have fun.
I completely agree with what @batko wrote about the need to keep IC events in an IC context and not internalize them.

I have suffered from my own fair share of bleed over the years. In fact I can remember the first time that wall of yellow text popped up on my screen because the staff told me to go take a break and chill out.

Bleed happens. If you find it happening, it's okay. Take a break. Put some things in context. Realize that it is part of the game.

I strongly disagree with the "you do nothing" being more OOC than IC.

For a person or character who defines their self-worth by their job, putting out a narrative that they do nothing and that their contributions are worthless is a dagger to the jugular. Hopefully they have friends and colleagues around to pump them up when SIC and randos tear them down. People who will encourage them to keep doing what they've been doing.

IMO , that is all part of the game. Insinuating that a person is wasting their time, other people's time and not getting any results that "anyone" cares about is perfectly themely and valid. IMO.

To steal a semi-regular SIC tag that I see around , "Mixers think a corporate job is a life support system for chyen." Yup. What exactly do corporates do all day? Other than sit around, and collect chyen for doing nothing? (/tongue in cheek)

It very much depends on the context. "You've done nothing to be proud of" is something I've heard quite a few times in real life.
Agreed, there are tons of ways of insulting someone, public or otherwise.

Going "You do nothing." is soooo 2106. All jokes aside, be creative and RP. And some people work hard, and don't have as much time as they want to dedicate to their character hence can't do much at all but still want to be part of the community, breathe it and feel it. Not everyone needs to be doing something 24/7 all the time, and some literally can't.

I will take this from my own standpoint, I work, care for a family, elderly in the household. I'm 'locked down' hard. Yet, just by being online, listening and RP as much as I can in those small moments I have? That makes the game for me and makes me see this as a cool, super cyberpunk society I'm part of.

Do nothing is a low blow OOC hit that's just annoying.

I think there are more creative insults that can resemble 'mixers think corporate jobs are a life support system for chyen'. Such as, calling them wageslaves, asking them if they think their corporation cares about them beyond the deadlines they meet, how comfortable is your cubicle, etc etc.

Falling back on 'you do nothing' is pretty uninspired and mixes OOC and IC. As I said in the original post, if the character isn't doing enough, point out specific things they're failing at, which is much better and less likely to cause bleed, in my eyes, while still being scathing.

Being skewered as unproductive would be the go-to shade of a hypercapitalist corporate dystopia wouldn't it? As a non-tech person who is often observing tech workplaces as an outsider, office workers bitching one another out on their failures in productivity towards the company is so common it starts being funny in a bleak way.

I haven't seen the chatter this is referring to though so I may be misunderstanding.

Yeah, I'm only really addressing the catch-all 'you do nothing' that is aimed very generally at people, not things like 'why the fuck aren't you contributing to our work project KAREN'. I think that's totally IC and themely.
Right, I see what you're saying.

I suspect what is happening is that player characters getting loudly called out for shirking their elected responsibilities and being passive in roles that require activity has been historically a really effective weapon, because when it gets to the point of public call-outs it's often a least partly true and tends produce an effect of some kind.

Players see this and learn that this is an approach that produces results, and mimic it without necessarily having the basis or insight to understand the context that called for it. We'll see this a lot with characters getting fired (for causes that may not be public) and player characters later trying to replicate that again against their enemies in a sort of Cargo Cult fashion. They go through the same movements, and say the same magic words, but it often doesn't work.

I don't personally have an issue with characters getting criticized for not living up to responsibilities they've agreed to take on, but I agree that if there's no actual evident reason to level this type of criticism at a character, and a player hasn't elected into a specific responsibility they're not living up to, then there is better shade to cast.

MENTAL SELF DEFENSE / How to NOT Bleed over "You do nothing"

"If you love what you do, you will never work a day in your life." has been attributed to Confucious.

If you as a player enjoy the time you spend playing Sindome, be happy with that.

If you find yourself comparing yourself to others, be kind and gentle and compassionate with yourself. You are valuable as a person. Your worth is not determined by your "output" as a character. You are no less or no more valued or appreciated as a member of the community than any other player is.

Remember that 90%+ of people being crappy to each other is projection. According to Jung's theory, people project their own shortcomings onto others. They project the parts of their subconscious that they cannot accept about themselves. We see it in politics all the time. The anti-gay / family values politician who ends up being gay, or having a gay family member. The law enforcement officer who hates corruption, but ends up being dirty. The Mixer who sits in their apartment all day doing nothing, and rants on SIC about how little other people do.

Starting to see a pattern?

Have fun.

Game on. =)

I completely agree with you batko. Especially 'you do nothing', though I will admit that it depends on how you put it. I only wanted to add another perspective on the 'you do nothing' line.

Often enough an IC character's activity level has little to do with the character themselves or IC circumstances. It's an artifact of OOC stuff. Maybe they can't log in as much. Maybe they can log in for more relaxed and lowkey RP but have limited time they can spend on high stakes rapid paced RP.

We all have lives out of Sindome and I want everyone to prioritize their real life. I am personally unwilling to do anything that might be akin to shaming them for prioritizing their real lives over our fun little internet game. And while there are cases where it's not related to OOC factors, the chance that it is is high enough in my mind to result in me just staying away from this one entirely.

Instead I will focus on WHAT the character does while active instead of focusing on how much time they spend active. And sure, maybe this means they shouldn't take on certain roles in the game but I'll let the GMs determine that as, in my experience, us players are far too gung ho and are overly critical about things - mostly because we lack the information the GMs have that allow them to make a more informed decision about what really is appropriate.

Just my personal preference.

Remember that 90%+ of people being crappy to each other is projection. According to Jung's theory, people project their own shortcomings onto others. They project the parts of their subconscious that they cannot accept about themselves. We see it in politics all the time. The anti-gay / family values politician who ends up being gay...

Hateful rhetoric against LGBTQ+ people actually just being queer people self-oppressing is a justification that is popular to shed any cishet responsibility for it, but has not been shown to be statistically true.

“I think one of the favored explanations — because it’s a good story, a good narrative — is the Freudian idea that a person is sexually repressed and has unconscious feelings that they don’t understand or maybe aren’t even aware of, but it leads them to engage in these hostile interactions towards people who are gay,” says Greg Herek, a professor of psychology at the University of California, Davis, who’s published several studies on anti-gay prejudice. “That probably happens, but it seems to be very much not the way that prejudice gets expressed in most cases.”

“It’s kind of a cliché to say people who are strongly prejudiced against sexual minorities are themselves gay or lesbian,” he adds. “That’s not the common story — for most people it comes from learning those cultural attitudes, not from their own sexuality.”

I agree with the sentiment here and offer an alternative. Do something. To the naysayer that attacks you with such hollow insults. Do something unpleasant and uncouth to them, and then challenge them to say it again.
My 2 chyen.

We all experience bleed sometimes, even the vets. Bleed behavior is pretty obvious, if you catch yourself bleeding just log out until you cool off and you can move on with your RP.

As for this specific instance, personally I would just ignore it if I knew it was bleed and I would hope the other player changes their behavior and if they don't then I would report them.

If I didn't know it was bleed I might do something about it if it becomes persistent behavior. But from an IC standpoint and without further context, its a pretty weak insult tbh. I think the problem here is 'knowing' its bleed and taking it personally.

Reacting IC to bleed can generate even more bleed, it can spread around and escalate the situation and then you might end up with an exsanguination.