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An open letter from the admin of Cybersphere

This was received from the admin of CS

Cybersphere and Sindome are two communities in an online universe of old-school RPG's that probably best represent the last bastions of true cyberpunk roleplaying on the net. Both Cybersphere and Sindome share common roots in a group of (many times shared between the two games) committed and talented folks who enjoy creating and playing in a deep, thought-provoking textual environment. The fact that these two games are all-text makes them an intellectual cut above 'newcomers' and pay-to-play games like Everquest, Asheron's Call, and other eye-candy experiences.
I begin with this long-winded introduction because I truly feel that CS and Sindome share two very meaningful and important aspects in common– they are both well-developed communities and they are both populated by smart individuals who want to have fun in creative and inventive ways. CS cannot ignore Sindome and vice versa, because we are inextricably linked by a common purpose and a shared playerbase.
That being said, the net is a community that polices itself and enforces its courtesies without police forces or governments. We look after each other and correct each other because we know that our communities will break down if we allow destructive or malicious activities in our midst. This brings me to the main point of this letter, from one member of a community to another.
A prominent programmer/administrator on the Sindome MOO, Damon ([email protected]), has maliciously and repeatedly attacked Cybersphere in a variety of ways. At one end of the spectrum, he has spammed Cybersphere's server and attacked the login prompt. At the other end of the spectrum, he has violated several of Cybersphere's rules, most notably the restrictions on OOC attacks and inflammatory statements against other players. He has used Cybersphere's benefit-of-the-doubt policy towards players to decieve and lie, gaining multiple player accounts in an attempt to return to the game after being sitebanned. Each time he returns, his goal is disruption of gameplay and slander of players and programmers alike. Cybersphere is a community that exists, in the end, because its population wants a fun place to roleplay. Damon is disruptive to that fun, not because he defies Cybersphere's administrators, but because he refuses to respect the worth of others in the community. Even more s!
erious, his attacks on the CS server-- a server that the CS admin don't even own or control-- risks the closure of Cybersphere. Our host, Netsville, has been very gracious to provide free support but any reasonable company would close down CS rather than expose itself to network problems associated with disruptive activities from the likes of Damon.
This brings me to my final point. Damon is not just another player. Damon is an administrator on Sindome, and as such, is an ambassador from that MOO. Certainly, no sane person sees Damon's actions as part of a concerted attack committed by Sindome against Cybersphere. However, Damon's actions reflect poorly upon Sindome, and his existance there as leadership sends the implicit message that Sindome condones destructive behavior on the net and in roleplaying communities. At the very least I hope that you will take a look at this individual and ensure that he's not using your resources to attack Cybersphere. At the very most, I hope that you will police your own and correct his abusive behavior. It is not my place as an administrator on Cybersphere to dictate how Damon should be handled on your MOO. However, when his actions threaten and disrupt Cybersphere, I assure you that our interest and response will be concerted and appropriate, and we will hold his actions and Sindome's !
response up to the light of public inspection in the meantime.

Respectfully,
The administrators of cs.vv.com.

Ummm…

*looks confused*

Haven't CS players attacked SD before in similar manners? But none the less...

Hrm, I dunno wether to rebuke Damon or ask him why he wasted his time trying to fuck up CS… I am very sure that if something like that occured against Sindome, Damon would be up in arms about it... :P

Not only that, but this is not a war. Like Johnny said, we are both two parts of a larger community. Trying to destroy one another will only end in both of our online 'games' (for lack of a better term) to be shut down... As for the attack on the server... eh...  I have nothing to say about it except for the fact that I think it uncalled for. If someone dislikes CS... there is a simple solution... don't go there, don't play their game, and leave them alone.

As for Damon, I just plead with him to do exactly that, leave em alone. We all know he has a mean streak when dealing with a Nic fit... *snicker* but that doesn't call for an attack on a server itself. Send an e-mail, ignore them, whatever. But the server is not CS, it is a seperate group that provides them bandwitdh to allow others to connect.

I think that about covers it... Though I never expected a Sindome Admin or Player to stoop to a level that said people once called 'CS'.

All I got to say.

That was not a letter from Johnny, but rather one from the CS admin, posted to thier in-game boards and forwarded to Johnny.  Johnny posted it here for feedback on how to handle it, I would say.  A statement to my actions, I will say this.  I do not deny being OOCly corosive on said MOO so that part of the accusation list is correct.  The part of the list that bothers me is that they would go as far as to say, unfounded, that I attacked thier login page and server.  Not only did this -not- happen and I would -not- do it, they decided to add this in the mix.  That disturbs me, but doesnt really suprise me.  They provided Johnny with an IP address of said incident that doesn't match up with -any- address I have -ever- logged in from, much less from -any- ISP I have -ever- used.  They were informed of this long ago and yet still felt the need to point fingers, use me as a scapegoat or just simply provide false accusations to further the trashing of my name in an attempt, possibly a successful one, to have me removed from a MOO I care a great deal about and have put quite a bit of time into in the past 2+ years.  I do not deny my actions of blasting them on more than one occasion privately, directly to them, and speaking my mind.  I do not deny the fact that this could, and should, result in a punishment, if nothing more than to save the name of Sindome.  I am a programmer, and quite a good one at that I believe.  I am, however, replaceable and expendible.  It may be temporarily detrimental to Sindome until I could be replaced, but it may be worth it in the long run for the Sindome Admin to do this.  This, in a nut shell, is exactly what CS wants.  Can I blame them?  No, not really.  I care a lot about Sindome, to the point where I would accept losing my bit in a heartbeat, with much regret but acceptance, if it were something that would help Sindome as a whole.
All I ask is for the Sindome community as a whole, staff and players included, to gather facts and take everything into account rather than a simple set of unfounded accusations before pointing any fingers, blame or hatred my way.

Thanks,
Damon

That is good to hear, and we know your are a valuable coder Damon… even if you do create monstrosities ever now and then... *coughs* *NLM BOARDS* *coughs*. Anyways, its good to hear you didn't stoop to said levels with the server attack... Means I won't have my computer going to hell anytime soon. ;-)
I won't even comment on this.  I haven't almost zero respect for any of the admin on that sleezy MOO.   I can pin point the time that the MOO took a turn from the worse, and I'm not afraid to say that most of the reasons are still there with a 'g' by their name.   Oh, that and they deleted my character after only a week of inactivity, then lying about it saying that the reaping period is 2 months.   Suffice to say, I don't go there anymore, I don't miss it, and I could care less what they thing of this MOO.
I say apologize and call it good. Don't repeat and forget them…

The first time I read that post by Incognito of CS I was impressed, impressed at his references to community, at his sensible attitude, his careful and thoughtful attempt at dealing with his situation…
Then I walked away, took a shower, thought about it a bit and realised something.
IT'S A CROCK OF TACTICAL SD BASHING BULLSHIT. It's nothing more than a cleverly worded and openly broadcast propaganda, doesn't contain a word of sincerity and isn't worth the time taken to type it. (In my humble opinion.)
Figure, since the day Sindome came to life CS admin have taken every opportunity to bash, thrash and badmouth the MOO. They've called us thieves, they openly posted conversations of discussions to proliferate their opinions of us, they've slandered, bitched and attacked the MOO at every single turn. I love this sudden new happy clappy 'we share' sense of community that CS has suddenly found, I love the way their first 'public' post about the two MOO's paints a pretty picture of them as a caring, sharing community which has been so woefully wronged by the evil nasty entity that is Damon.
BULL-FUCKING-SHIT.

Sindome has been attacked in a similar manner on a couple of occasions. Twice I have approach CS admin for their assistance in locating the guilty parties and have been told that the IP addies provided to them -do- possibly match members of the CS 'community' but it's not their place to divulge their players information and it's not their problem. Now, perhaps one thing I agree with Incog on, we don't for a second suggest that the people perpetrating these acts are acting as representatives of CS, hell no, but evidence openly suggests these people are part of the CS 'community' and they chose to protect their own.

Damon is, by his own admission, guilty of being a complete and utter ass as a player on CS. But then again, so are god knows how many other people. I can think of at least a dozen players who I've encountered on CS who have been out to disrupt play, returned after toadings and been offensive towards admin and players alike. Fuck, I'm guilty of all of that. But that's my personal opinions/actions and nothing to do with my business as an admin here. As an admin here I couldn't give a squirt of the mooses finest about CS.
Damon has never used SD resources in any of his actions, he's never discussed or plotted disruption of CS on SD, his actions are in no way a part of any plot or conspiracy. If his actions had ever been a big deal on SD then something would have been done about it before, but fact of the matter is, the first we ever hear of these events is when the CS admin choose to bring it to us.

So, thus far, Damon hasn't done much that warrants severe action on the part of SD. So, we come to the alleged server attacks, which actually happened several months ago and CS have decided to drag up once more. To cut a long story short, they've provided IP addies that don't match any addy Damon has ever logged onto SD from, so what the fuck are we supposed to do? Take their word that Damon perpetrated these attacks? I've had my disputes with Damon, I rarely agree with him, if there was proof he'd commited these attacks I'd be the first to vote for punishment, but THERE'S NO FUCKING PROOF. There wasn't any proof when it happened, there is no proof now. Bring us proof and we will act, until then, you're producing what CS is rapidly becoming famous for, BULLSHIT. Infact, you know what, get your host to follow it up, if the attack was carried out against their server then I'm sure they should be following it up. Try attacking the SD server and see how quickly our host drops on your ass. Attack/disrupt the MOO, it's our problem, attack the host and you're in for a whole nother story, we wouldn't even get a look in the matter.

So, stick it where the sun don't shine, Incog.

Oh, and some choice tidbits about our new 'community' minded friends...

Neo isn't the only SD admin to have his CS char 'mysteriously reaped'. Another of our admin was approached by an un-named CS admin and offered a GM slot on CS. He declined. Mysteriously, his character and his seriously oldbie vacationed char were reaped shortly afterwards. No pre-reap email saying log in soon or we reap, nor was he inactive for their so called 2 month inactivity period.

Incog, the 'community minded' CS admin who made that wonderful post, is one of the CS admin who was involved in spreading rumors that SD admin had 'infiltrated' another MOO project, Halogen Bleach, with the intention of sabotaging the project. Hey Incog, you collecting those crocks of shit or what?

I've dealt with Incog on numerous occasions. Not once has he found it possible to discuss things with even a ounce of reservation or dignity, he is corrosive, offensive and scathing in his comments about SD. Same goes for a significant number, if not all, of the CS admin. Frankly I couldn't give a shit what they think, but it just makes that lovey dovey 'open letter' so much more of a complete and utter joke.

Cut to the fucking chase, play by your own rules and get outta mah face with that spin-doctored bullshittery posting.

Bring proof and Damon will be dealt with. If you want community then help us as much as you want to help us. AND FOR FUCKS SAKES, STOP THIS MISINFORMED MANIPULATIVE BULLSHIT. Tell it how it FUCKING is or don't bother, you PATHETIC sons of MOTHER FUCKING bitches.

Hrmm, oh... Disclaimer: I wrote this shit, I thought this shit. This shit don't represent the views of Sindome or the Sindome group. Etc. Just in case you're thinking I should be punished for my actions as an 'ambassador of Sindome' or whatever crap you want to spout next time.

*stands and applauds, wiping a tear from his eye*
Beautiful… just... fucking beautiful...

Never knew you had it in ya Rastus. I for one have never touched CS, but from what I've heard its everything you just described and more... soooo... yea.

BTW... Did Sindome's theme hit the real world and CS became the WJF? Because they seem to have a problem dealing with what some people call 'Free Speech'.

Peace.

*deletes back biting comment*

…Rastus, your rants always make me smile.

---

STICK IT TO THE MAN CHILDREN!!

What Damon does elsewhere on his own time is his biz. If Neo went out and killed 13 people…would we demote him??

would we?

13, no.

14, Maybe a bit. :P

I won't lie, when Sindome got slow and nothing was going on, infact for the better part of the two years I've been with Sindome I was playing CS. Through the last few months however I relised how much Sindome ment to me (don't laugh at me you rotton pricks ;) ) How many great friends I've met there that will last a good long while if not forever. How upset I was when I thought the MOO was going down forever because there wasnt a server to put it on. I can tell you now, you log on to CS your first time, beg for some help you get smart assed remarks, utter bullshit and the catch phrase 'Find out ICly'.  Hows that for fucking community? I can say I havn't had RP there for quite some time. Its KILL KILL WHINE BITCH KILL BITCH. Dispite what Damon has or has not done, that he can have his 'bad' days… He's been here for a good while, has put as much effort into the MOO as anyone else has and what he does on his time should not reflect the entire MOO of Sindome. Does one class clown make the whole class a bad one? No... Rastus put it best in his post, what they did was complete and utter bullshit and a way to boost their self esteem. I can't count how many people have left that place because of the lack of interest the admins put forth...

To me, I see Sindome as a community, family... Everyone works together, throwing out ideas on how to make the MOO better, fun and an enjoyable experiance and I thank every one of you, granted I havn't been around as much as I should have been, but I am now.

FUCK CS and their arrogant little 'I am god' attitude, because in my opinion, and looks like alot of others, they are nothing more then a 'has been' and a group of people who continue to talk out of their asses.

Nixxi, you forgot one thing to do on CS!

Leave your char sleeping in a coffin for weeks at a time, signing on every now and again, preventing reapage.

No, I didn't forget anything *blinks* I hope to god they reap me. I have no intention of ever playing there again, I have far to much fun on Sindome.
Hrm….. I wonder if they were to blame for that hack that we had... I swear, I bet they have people looking for ways to fuck us over.
Well Nic, that doesn't always work.. sometimes they will reap you anyway, especially if you are an oldbie and said something that they do not agree with.. like standing up for SD. I think everyone knows where I stand on that place and I'm not going to say too much more… 'cause I don't think anyone wants to get me started.

In any case... wombats are funny.

Let me speak on dis….Having never played CS (I don't think, I may have had a char for about 10 mins but I'm not sure.) I can't really comment on them or their actions allegations. But I can comment on Damon! That back stabbing 2 faced so called SD "admin"....

Ok nevermind those things really aren't true...Damon can be a bitch, especally when you haven't loged on in forever and then come back and he puts a price on your head:) True damon has his "days" but all in all, it' s what makes the dome go round. Johnny-Thank you for the greatest RPable MOO EVER! Damon and all the other admins-Thank you for fixing all of the TB's that happen at the most inopertune times. Thank you for ~ALL~ the code and thank you for making SD fun!!!! SD is truely a community and a Family! and this thread has proved as such.  The answer to the question what should come of Damon? NOTHING. Damon how dare you speak your mind!;) Damon is good at what he does and it would be a setback to SD development and community for us to loose him or anybody that lives in or works on SD.

viva la dome!!!


ps-I haven't been around as much as should have been but I'm back until RL kicks me in the ass again...but I can't seem to stay away:)

Sath, Damon -Can't- put a price on your head, just want to clarify. He's an admin, therefore has nothing to do with the IC world.
Ohhh grrrr, Hmmm all you admin types have your secret little chars and shtuff, I know it was one of you….I KNOW it was!!! :) and I'll prove it....I don't know how I'll prove it but I will!!!


oh well

Blarg Blah Blah.  Why is it always Damon.  All anyone ever is give him shit, and i'd say we are lucky he doesn't kill 1/2 us cause i think i would feel the urge if i were him :).  That may have been a little blunt, and oh yeah.  10 bucks says johnny made that letter to bring us together. ;)
well…i dont especially like everything the admin on CS do and i let them know. but ive logged in to SD on a couple of occassions...once when i had a builder and it was just getting started and then when a couple of friends were playing and i decided to check it out.
that lasted about 10 minutes.
first you start in the middle of nowhere. you have no access to a map. i asked an admin for a map and he told me to 'find out ICly' a phrase someone was just bitching at the admin on the sphere for using. so i wasnt gonna wander around blindly til i got lucky enough to see an actual player or find the shop for the com unit. i rudely told the admin that the starting position needs to be more centralized and that you should have some way to find the com unit.
anyways, i never logged on again.
seriously, i bet you guys got about every problem CS does....maybe more.
Actually, you start at the city gates (which is very logical). And two steps away are the coffins with the OOC note to get you started. And two steps further is Carnal Desires, which usually has at least one or two players in it. And there are maps on the website. And if a Judge sees you without an implant he'll tell you where to get one or drag you there by the scruff of your neck, and you could have typed @newbie (which you are told to do at the end of chargen) and figured out all you need to know to get started like that. Don't blame your laziness on the admins.
*ahems and points out the words beta testing on the login screen*

We're not finished with how players enter the game.. in fact that whole thing is pending an overhaul and will be quite a bit more newbie friendly.

We know about the problems and yes we are fixing them. If you were only there for 10 minutes, don't speculate on how many problems we have or don't have. There are plenty of players who have no problem finding their way around.

Looking for something and you're told to find out ICly by a GM? Do it.. go talk to the nearest NPC. I'm sure you'll get a response. You "rudely told the admin"? How's that help anyone? If you have a problem with finding out ICly and want to make a valid suggestion there's no need to be rude about it.. and I'm sure after hearing that you're a bit lost the GM would give you a hand or at least point you in the right direction. Sounds like you've become a bit jaded with your time someplace else.

I'll also ask this not turn into a bitchfest and rant about the two MOOs, because I'm sure it could quite easily turn in that direction.

Normally I'd have alot to say about Drone's post, but frankly I think Murphy's post says it all. I -know- we're doing something right when the first person to post in response to a CSer is one of our players, and a player who's been with us less than two months to boot.

Sorry Drone, Murphy just put you in your place. Two months of play and he's had no trouble at all becoming a key part of the IC world. I agree with FS, your time on elseMOO has dulled your senses. If you come to SD expecting your knowledge of CS to apply then yea, you're going to find problems. It's a whole new learning curve, buddy.

We don't need an OOC map because 9 times out of 10 our NPC's will be responsive and if they're not, @newbie tells you -all- you need to know to get started. If you have a problem /reading/ or think the instructions don't apply to you coz you're already 'experienced' elsewhere then sorry, that's not -our- problem. We respond "Find out ICly" to IC questions. My persistant mocking of CS for that phrase is from the time I asked if I could talk to an admin and was told "Find out ICly.", I mean c'mon… Then they got all pissy when I asked Mick if I could talk to an admin... *titter*

And just because you couldn't find an OOC map, doesn't mean there aren't several options available ICly to find various maps.

Sorry if this all sounds a tad insulting, but seriously, being the experienced CSer you are I expected better. Starting -any- new M* is a tough experience with a learning curve. Expecting it to be handed to you on a plate after 10 minutes of play? Find me -any- M* that does that.

Here's an open offer. I -know- you're not a totally unreasonable guy and I'm pretty sure you'd be an asset to our player base. Come back some time, contact me and I'll personally make every effort I can to get you started and past the n00b stages as quickly as possible. It's nothing I don't ultimately do for any newbies I get chance to talk to, but frankly, these days I'm usually too busy with code to deal with -any- players, newbies or otherwise. You took the time to trash us on a 10 minute experience, now take the time to at least find out if your trashing was justified.

Same goes for me. I usually make it a point to help if asked, and I really mean help. Often, I jump in and ask if they need help, when I am around. There is alot to learn here, and it takes time, but once you get through the initial stages, its not difficult in the slightest.

I hope you try it out sometime, xhelp if you need it.

Yup comin' soon. All your suggestions drone are good suggestions, some are in the works if not most. We're even going to have some pre-starting place dialogue so that it's not just 'BLAMO! you can start now'.  We're trying to decide if we want to start nOObs out with SIC implants or not…how to handle that with permadeath because each implant has an ID number that'd need changingwith each character.  Also, in Withmore there will be a HUGE effort for an IC immigration center...and maps/job direction etc is all IC. On CS the map is OOC (at least it seems to be).

For now, what we tryand do (since we're in beta) is do more hands on. The code's not there to assist nOObs as affectively as we'd like...so we as GMs do our best (when not busy, and at times even when we are busy) to help out directly.

Yes we use the phrase "Find Out ICly", but only when and if the answer can be found out ICly.

For a first character I think it's good to do some mindless wandering...that's how I learned when there wasn't even gear in stores...

We monitor every NPC at all times. We do our best to create a realistic world where NPCs are people too...

I too hope you come back and try it here again. Yes we have lots of things that are incomplete, but we also have CS to thank for the experience that's allowed the Justices and coders here to create better systems.

Thanks for stopping by.
Next time bring COOKIES!!!

God is an athiest.