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Eye camera module
For the paydata

Pretty straightforward. New module for cybereyes that let you snap a picture instead of having to hold and use a camera.

The only problem is how they'd print out though, unless it prints out of your mouth or you shit it out or something. Open to ideas in that part.

Nice idea. Maybe you upload the images somewhere?

A small port inside said eye that extends a wire that you can plug into a Nito-Kodak camera to upload it.
This doesn't exist already? It should!

Maybe it could interface with an e-note printer or something? Like...there's a memory slot or something like that? Like a skillsoft?

Oooh. Maybe another new item?

A port or jack that you could plug a memory module into? It stores the "photo" that could be moved to an e-note and printed from there?

Photo printing kiosks? Hmmm ....

Also it'd be cool to have the memory of the eye camera be accessible to you if you vat your enemy and install his module into your own eye to see what kinda photos they took
Wirelessly uploading photos into a Nito-Kodak camera?
Even better. Why didn't you get this idea earlier? Lol.

I really would love this together with new, more expensive, printer that you can then jack your eye into.
To me a camera is a weapon. Especially secret cameras people can't see. How would you balance this item to ensure it isn't abused? As it is it's pretty much impossible for someone to take a picture without you knowing and if you have a problem with it you can chase them down, steal it, something.

My first thoughts:

The room must be told when a picture is taken.

Pictures CAN'T be printed; for your eyes only.

Module makes the cyber eye look different somehow.

Also I'd like this to be able to be paired with telescopic lenses for reasons
Grey0,

as a disadvantage the memory should only be allowed to hold 3 photos maximum at one time to avoid people just taking photos of everything along with a cool down of the chrome, or if you do it multiple times you fuck up because your neurons misfire or something due to all the visual stimulus at once

I don't see why they can't be printed, what's the point in me taking a photo at all if I can't use it as evidence to show people?

Because from what I've heard it would simply encourage even less biz being conducted out and about. I don't want to have yet more reasons why people largely sit in their pads, bars or other chummer's pads.
It doesn't have to be secret photo taking that you won't notice, I don't think I ever mentioned that being part of the chrome.
It will be if you merge functionality with telescopic lenses.
Technically yes, but that's three pieces of cyberware that you'd have to pay for and handle the PDS load with. I think that functionality is pretty much worth it -- I disagree that it'd force people to sit in their pads.

Instead it'd make people hire lookouts to make sure their biz being conducted is safe and the area is secure. Which means more RP for more people.

You could make it require supplemental chrome as well, so that it's not such an 'easy' thing to do. Like visual overlay optical modules to see the photos via the chrome and maybe something like the video transcoding if you want to download to something in order to print it.
I'm not completely against it but I am not convinced that this would enhance game play more than it would harm it. I honestly don't see someone hiring X look outs to cover all possible rooms some baka with this setup might be able to cover then they can just take it off the streets.

I tend to be cautious though so there is a very real chance I am overreacting here. :-)

I think people don't hire lookouts because there's no real threat. Right now you need to be in the room to snap a photo. That means whoever is doing the business can react and chase down the spy themselves and don't need extra eyes.

If someone went through the effort to get all this chrome and is snooping around and people know it's possible, I very well would hire someone -- even an immy -- to stick around outside the room the biz is being held in and see if someone is attempting it, considering telescopic lenses already give you away as it is and anybody can see where you look towards with them.

I think it’s an outstanding idea. You guys act like there aren’t cameras everywhere. Some of us already see that shit you’re up to :D

This would be great for the pay data aspect of things.

Dear me are people practicing caution with their crimes?!?!!

Are people still not going to care? Yup!

Is it gonna be in every player? Probably not but maybe you should buy a cyberware defector and make sure. I highly doubt this would be bad for the game.

The best balancing factor for it I can imagine is the price. Make it pricy and visible, well, if someone sees you with that photo-eye they may decide to just rob you and rip it out of your socket to sell it on for very hefty profit.
There's plenty of other options that this would be redundant for.

While I agree, it is neat, I think balancing wise, it undermines the options already present and wouldn't add anything to or shake up the longstanding meta. The same for while any new private recording devices haven't emerged.

The more obfuscation in the game, the better.

Love the idea, and honestly thought it was already in the game. I don't see any reason the camera eye should be any more visible than any other cybereye, this type of subterfuge is what CP is all about. Make people more wary of chrome, and those who have it. Give more reason to have cyberware sensors, give more reasons to get chrome. Give more incentive for someone to get caught spying with their chrome and have it cut out of their bodies and sold by ripper docs.
I still don’t understand the “balance “ need as if it is some kind of OP game changer. Why would it be different then any other module? It’s basically, from what it sounds like, a funcam with s PDS load. Pair it with telescopic lenses and you can take a stillshot wherever your line of sight takes you. It’s not a briefcase nuke. Don’t want your picture taken selling that firearm? Don’t do it in public. I’m all about this idea until surveillance cameras can take stillshots or physical proof aside from just seeing it in real time or limited playback.
The reason why it's a balance issue is because it's physical evidence. All other surveillance methods besides photo-taking cameras all revolve around taking someone at their word or experiencing it yourself in the moment (listening, watching through chrome or the appropriate secure tech gear).

Photo-taking cameras take actual evidence that can be printed out and viewed by others at any time. Photo-taking cameras can also be stolen from someone's hands, picked up and stolen, sold, retrieved and viewed after the fact. They can be temporarily handed over to be viewed by the necessary authorities.

The only way it works is under Grey's suggestion of striking out the print option for a camera eye module. Otherwise there's only two ways to view, erase or take the photos from someone who's just shot them: cybernetic removal or removal by death.

Unless you want to add in a security tech/general tech/general use tool like analysers which could scan an eye for the module, read/view the pictures, copy the pictures and/or delete the pictures forcibly. So you'd have to balance that too in addition to creating the tool, you'd have to consider if potential skill checks are needed.

Yes, strike out the print option to render it totally useless. Will just fly off of the shelves! People will be lined out the door to pair it with their skin watches.

It sounds like a lot of “I wanna do hood rat things with my friends but I don’t want to have any risk of getting caught “. Which is silly in big brother world if you don’t practice caution.

I appreciate the sarcastic remark to serious replies, Grizzly.

If people wanted to do hood rat things with their friends without risk of being caught, people would advocate for the removal of all cameras, of any kind, all chrome surveillance and all secure tech gear. No one's doing that here from what I've read. Some people are pointing out the differences in picture taking cameras opposed to other kinds of chrome/gear, though, and why it turns into a balance issue.

I also offered a perfectly viable solution (time permitting to code, of course; so maybe not so viable) if people insisted on the print option. Could also work that into deckers being able to forcibly delete pictures in grid 3.0 if a person with a eye camera module is linked in to the grid. That might get a little messy, though. Analysing tools could be the best course of action.

Alternatively, I could counter your last sentence with "it sounds like a lot of 'combat characters want to be able to take pictures with only one way to take it away from them - combat'.

Which I don't think is the case of Ranger's original suggestion. I don't think it's the case of Grey, HolyChrome or my comments about balance issues either, despite your witty remark. We're pointing out the differences between all other surveillance equipment and photo-taking cameras inside the game. It's important to recognise the differences and how providing physical evidence is a big deal with how the world is coded, constructed and the tools available to our characters.

Uncertainty is a huge part of RP, full stop.

I've been an advocate for things like telescopic lenses on cameras before, but knowing that there's no counter to them, besides being disguised, is a bit against the grain.

There's tons of ways to take pictures and document things already.

However the key to it is in the sell. The RP you put into what loose things you have.

It's not about people getting away with things. It's not about people getting caught. It's not about catching other people. It's about the space between all those things that I think is important to take into account here.

I would say most people either don’t even realize cameras are in a huge abundance or know of their limitations.

Combat characters needing to take a photo but wanting it only taken away through combat? I don’t see the relevance of your example because that is mainly (or the threat of such) relieve someone of their cameras already.

Look, I’m not going to further debate it, because It will probably never happen. We have more CP things to worry about like photo albums and color coordinated lipsticks I’m just saying it’s a great idea for cyberware and removing an ability to print a photo from a camera renders said camera useless. This is hugely fact. You know it, I know it, they know it. Three sources right there.

@Grizzly666

Wise words, like usually, I can't disagree.

I'll reply later, but I just want to point out the 'cameras exist, why do we need this?'is kind of a strawman argument. We have scopes you can install on guns and we have binoculars. Why do we have certain chrome that function as these items because it 'undermines' them like you suggested this would undermine cameras?

Chrome overlapping with certain other aspects of the game happen and bringing that up is kind of a moot point. Just take vee chummer instead of using that chrome! sounds very funny to me.

I also disagree that there are already loads of options to take photos already, HolyChrome. I really don't think so, but I guess our sense of 'a lot' differ so I can't say anything about that.

Telescopic lenses aren't anonymous. I don't see what the fuss is about considering you can see people using them. If you do your biz on the street and someone from far away notices it, that is kind of your fault.

For the 'sake of RP and balance' some of the comments are trying to make it seem like this would make it harder and make people think twice before doing their business in public... and I believe that should be a thing anyway?

In regards to cameras being able to be stolen and given away - this can't be given away to the authorities. There's one of your cons.

You want people to be able to pick the photos from people? Make it so that you need to slot a memory module like a skillsoft that you can take in/out. You see someone snap a photo? Demand them to take the memory chip and give it to you like a celebrity aping out at paparazzi.

I really don't see the problem you said when chrome has and is supposed to make things easier for you, the player, with aspects of the game. Just like my examples above regarding binoculars.

Besides, if we gotta be this picky with every good chrome feature, then we might as well just drop the whole CP theme and use basic tech in-game like flip-phones or literal 50's computer terminals, alongside the funcams.
@Rangerkrauser

+1

Would love seeing this in-game.

To rephrase what I said in my last post.

Pick up the photos from people WITHOUT necessarily having to kill them. Which I think also would be another con because then when you take a picture with this you might have signed your death sentence as opposed to using a normal camera. Riskier. I also don't see why that's a problem.

I honestly don't get what is the big issue with "balance". If you don't want to be seen, stay behind closed doors. If you are doing biz in public, don't feel safe just because you have thermal in eyes and can spot almost any speaker. And on top of that you are sure that no one takes any photos because, if they will, you will know about it. Which, I would say is meta as fuck, as by our 20th-century brains we know that photos can be taken from afar, but ICLy we must ignore that.
I feel that I am being misunderstood and that is largely my fault for not wording things clearly and for simply presenting initial impressions and partially formed thoughts. I am not saying that this is 100% bad, terrible ugly and should never happen. Ut I do think that balance and game play are important and seemingly innocent add ins can have big impacts. I've seen it come up before.

I simply feel that are a variety of things that probably could and should be thought of by those who call the shots and by us players. Just because something sounds cool doesn't mean it will have a healthy impact on the game. Doesn't mean it will encourage or necessitate PvP and conflict and risk taking. Maybe this would and maybe it wouldn't. I just want it to be considered.

I feel I am fairly familiar with a lot of the surveillance systems and forms of proof available in the game. I will be completely honest and say that I don't like a lot of them for various reasons. Some feel way over powered and have no real counter available. Some, in my opinion, result in PCs sitting in front of screens instead of going out to gather data or paying people to do so. And I may be in the minority but this idea of pervasive surveillance already existing in the game means it's all good is not a given for me.

I don't get the last part of your comment, Grey0. I'm just confused on whether you think other surveillance options already existing should be a counter argument against this or not?

I agree that sitting in front of screens happens. And I also think something like this would actually have people get up and go out to actually spy on people with counterplay possible (lookouts or your regular camera counter -- chase them down).

I think it'd definitely encourage PvP considering so far from the ways I suggested you end up either being killed or forced to give something away.

But again, that's of course up to the staff to actually debate.

@Grizzly666

+1

If you're a mixer, and you want to do mixer things, give your figurative balls a tug and do them. Tell everyone to take a picture and draw their lips across afformentioned balls cause you are a badass. Or, if you even think they took your picture, stomp their face in and prove it.

I like the camera eyes idea, and wireless transmitting could be good if you just have to "balance" I personally don't understand why but hey you do you. If someone could sneak up behind you, or tackle you and hold you down, and wave {insert whatever device you want to make do this} behind your head and steal your photos. Problem solved IMHO.

RE: a small bit of 'balance' and interesting opportunities, you could couple the module to some kinda of small bit of implantable storage (the photos gotta be stored somewhere?) a la Johnny Mnemonic, that both has some kind of high PDS ratio and/or some kind of intelligence hit (idk, because it has to sit in your brain) that is ALSO hackable by deckers with the right skills and some kinda of tool (wireless...something? maybe a cracked version of the same tool you need to use to print the photos?) so you can (again, this is all Johnny M) kidnap or take some dude's head if they have photos in there you REALLY don't want them having.

Very sorry for the double post -- meant to word the last bit to show that this makes the paydata the person may have in their properly steal-able by other parties, whether hey have it or not, making the data courier themselves also extra paranoid -- excellent, right?!

I love this overall idea btw, I like adding more ways to create information-as-power and general paranoia to the game, and offer folks more things to do than combat. Fantastic idea.

I definitely do agree the photos stored wherever should be able to be stolen one way or another -- that is a given. Deckers being involved in this would be pretty cool too - transmit photos FROM or TO the storage and use them as datarunners. It definitely sounds more themely that someone has this data/photo that will rock the city stored into their head and you gotta hack into it or kill them instead of 'give me your camera chummer' - at least in my opinion.